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They Call Me Mista Yu / One On One with Mista Yu
Big Blue Lifers Podcast - Giants Free Agency, Identity Crisis, GM Joe Schoen, NFL Draft
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Mr. Yu and Jess launch their dream podcast dedicated entirely to New York Giants football, offering passionate analysis on all things Big Blue.
• Giants free agency receives a B+ grade with Holland and Adebo signings
• Offensive line and right guard concerns
• Evan Neal experiment
• QB discussion with Cam Ward or Shedeur Sanders at #3
• Giants face difficult decision if Ward and Daniels are gone, with generational talents Abdul Carter and Travis Hunter as alternatives
• Team has lost its identity of smash-mouth football that defined previous championship teams
• Head coach Brian Daboll needs significant offensive improvement and playoff contention to save his job
• The draft scenario of trading back carries risks with high-value prospects potentially unavailable later in the first round
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What's up everybody? Big blue lifers podcast, our very first show. I'm Mr U. Just as in the house, we are your hosts and we are excited about being here to talk all Giants Matter of fact. It's a dream come true for both of us. I guess we can talk about it a little bit here in the beginning of the show. But, man, ever since I started podcasting five years ago, one thing I definitely wanted to do was have a place to talk about my favorite team, which is the New York football Giants, and I do it on other shows. I'm invited on other shows to talk about them specifically, but it's different when you're in your house. You know and you know that you know where this is your spot. They can people come in, but at the end of the day, this is Giants country, this is Giants territory. Everything we talk about is all blue here. So we both bleed blue, man, but I'm excited. This is a dream come true for me. I think you were saying the same thing, man. Dream come true for you as well, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've been a New York Giants fan, new York sports fan, my whole life. Ask any of my buddies about it. I can talk about this team all day, all night, and I'll still have enough room for tomorrow, so let's.
Speaker 1:I'm excited man yeah, man, same here. Man, we're gonna have some fun. Man, this is, this is awesome stuff. So this is our first venture out here. We're not new to podcasting. We've both been doing it for a little bit, but doing you know all giants all the time. It's a new one for us. So we uh ventured out here. But there's a lot going on.
Speaker 1:As you already know, nfl Free Agency has kicked off. It's died down quite a bit. The first week was hectic. Our phones were buzzing and vibrating and ringing off of the hook for the first week of Free Agency and then after that next week started kind of going downhill. We were just talking about it on our show, our flagship show, t3, that Thursday thing a little while ago, and we realized that the Giants did what they were supposed to do, even though a lot of the fans. We want to hear from you guys what you think, how you felt about Giants free agency, if you want your thoughts on that one. But in my opinion I feel as though the Giants did what they were supposed to do with free agency.
Speaker 1:In the draft you get day one, starters and whatnot, to solidify positions, and in free agency you plug holes that you have on your lines or in your organization and we had so many debt issues last year it was ridiculous. We were short in every way, shape and form. So the guys that we got not big names really A lot of them some of them are, but some of them are not really big names. But they, they meet the right criteria, they can play in multiple positions, they satisfy Japanese that we have. So I'm excited, man, but overall I know that there's one guy that went to a different team that you want to get into. I gonna let you do that real quick. But overall, how you feel about free agency as far as giants go, how do we do, in your opinion so far?
Speaker 2:yeah, I definitely give this free agency a, b plus um. Only reason I can't quite give it an a is because I would have loved to see them really go after a right guard, and I think we're going to talk about that a little bit more later in the pod. But you know, all we did was for the guard position was re-sign Stinney, re-sign Roden, but I would have liked us to go after Will Freeze, tevin Jenkins Both are now signed. Mekhi Becton even he's signed elsewhere.
Speaker 2:I think the only main names left at that position are former Giants in Zeitler and Hernandez, but I love the Holland signing, I love the Debo signing. Like you said, we addressed a lot of depth concerns so hopefully that won't be an issue moving forward. But overall I think this is mostly positive. Shane kind of did what he said he was going to do. He wasn't going to go out and just spend all of the money, backload all these contracts, essentially kind of you know, screw over possibly the next GM, kind of like Gettleman did, incidentally, to him. So we just got to get a quarterback up or two up in here. So you know, we'll have to see where they go with that, but that'll be another thing we're getting into.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think we did pretty decent, considering, I mean, a lot of these guys were there. I mean GVR, man, ivr I don't have a problem with having brought him back. He missed a snap last season and the man plays 40 positions on the line. Honestly, with the depth issue we had last year and I'll be honest, I'll probably say 2023 as well we had depth issues then too To have a guy that plays all the snaps and he can play multiple positions on the line when you need it Four out of five positions on the line that man's a, he's gold for us and we didn't pay him a lot to even bring him back.
Speaker 1:That's totally fine man. I'm glad to have the veteran back in there. I mean, he's had multiple starts at center and right guard and left guard, so he can do a lot of things there. I do have some guard concerns that I thought we would deal with. Like you said, in free agency, I didn't know that Zeitler was still out there, but he got picked up, so that's good. So, if Zeitler's available and you need somebody else as well, but we could use some help there.
Speaker 2:Has Zeitler been signed? I didn't think I saw anybody sign him, no, no, he went to the Titans. That's my bet.
Speaker 1:So who's the other guy you named? The only real name left is Will Hernandez.
Speaker 2:I believe.
Speaker 1:Wow, I like that when he first came to us, but I don't know. I would not mind bringing Will Hernandez back. Bring that down for me. Tell me why. Tell me why. Because fans are going to have our heads even talking about this. So tell me why. Tell me why you want to bring him back.
Speaker 2:Like most Giants players, he left and got better, so theoretically we're getting this improved version of them.
Speaker 2:Hey, that's the truth I mean quite honestly and I think you and I agreed about this on one of the previous pods that we did, talking about the Giants on some other shows the Giants offensive line when it was healthy, with the new pieces, played well. It wasn't you know some top 10 offensive line, but overall it was in an average to above average offensive line which is better than anything the Giants have had really for the last. What 10 years, 13 years? You got to go maybe back to 2010-2011 for the last truly good Giants offensive line. If you want to get to an elite group, you have to go back to that 07-08 unit. But I mean you and I agree Football is one in the trenches. It doesn't matter if you have Patrick Mahomes back there, if he's getting hit every play.
Speaker 2:A lot of people mocked that comment by Joe Shane when he said that on Hard Knocks, not even Patrick Mahomes could win behind this offensive line. Well, look at what happened to the Chiefs and Mahomes when he encountered a great defensive line in the Super Bowl. We saw that would happen to him in 2021. I'm not saying the Giants should be one of those teams. If you have an option to draft Cam Ward at three or something you pass on that? That's not what I'm saying. But if we can bring in Will Hernandez for like two years, eight to 10 mil per, not that much guaranteed I'm more than willing to take a flyer on him.
Speaker 1:Okay, I got another name to drop on this because a lot of what you said I think people would also remember all you said. I want to get into several things that you said there regarding Joe Shane and just you know, a couple of other points. But Brandon Sherford's name that I pulled up today for another show for our show, he was with the Jaguars. Last Brandon Scherfer's name that I pulled up today for another show for our show, he's with the Jaguars. Last was with the. What do they?
Speaker 2:call it the Commanders. What do they?
Speaker 1:call it Redskins?
Speaker 2:I'm not even sure now, Commanders, I think he's been on the Jags, he's been on the Commanders.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he started with the Commanders. I think they drafted him and then the Jagss uh, a lot of injuries. Uh, he's a guy that when he came out in the draft he's somebody that I wanted. Then I think we had a guard need way back when he came out. So I kind of wanted him but the commander snagged him first. That's our rival, so I was really ticked off about that one. But I mean, he's a top five pick, definitely has all the potential. Not a whole bunch of good looks recently, but still capable as a starter. I think we can do worse at guard. I know that JVR can play guard, but I don't think the Giants want him to, at least not the guard position on the right side. I think they want somebody else there and honestly I'm totally out on the whole Evan Neal experiment. I'm sorry, after a certain amount of time it's really hard to keep on holding out hope for this. I think we missed on this one. We whiffed on this one.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah. One of the biggest draft busts I've ever seen.
Speaker 1:I can't imagine what he can do to help.
Speaker 2:They're saying now they're going to move him to guard. Is it too little, too late?
Speaker 1:Yes, it is too little, too late. How many years are we going to do this? Come on, we're done. This is not working. He'll probably go somewhere else and light it up. That's fine, go right ahead, but it's not working with us. We got to do something else. So, besides Brandon Scherf, I don't know who else is left at guard. I'm sitting trying to push through it. I think Aaron Banks got signed with the Packers, so he's already over the table. I don't know who's left out there. So I'm almost positive that we're going to get somebody in the draft and we can get into that at some point if we have time in this episode today, because there's a lot of guys that are guards that I happen to love. A couple of guys that play guard and tackle I would love to have and they're within range for us, providing we do things the right way with the first round, but beside Brandon Scherf and I don't know who's left.
Speaker 2:Those are the two. I didn't even think of Scherf I didn't even realize he was still available.
Speaker 1:Yes, he's just sitting there. I'm almost positive. The Giants probably didn't give him a call.
Speaker 2:No, no, no.
Speaker 1:I think the only move, why not?
Speaker 2:I think the only move outside of maybe some other one-year $1.2 million special teams guy they're going to make, I think the only notable move the Giants are going to make in free agency moving forward is who they end up bringing in for quarterback, be it Rodgers, Wilson, Winston, Flacco. Trade for Cousins that's still on the table. The Falcons seem more than happy to get rid of him. Maybe take a flyer. Do they do it for Joe Milton with the Patriots? That could be interesting, but I don't know what kind of draft capital would be asked from the Giants for either the Cousins or Milton.
Speaker 1:Milton the Patriots. They're probably going to try to get a three out of it, but I don't really think that. I think if we offer a four, I think they should take it Now. He played at Michigan, so I'm already a fan of his. I like him. Nobody I talk to likes him and thinks he can do anything. They say he got an arm, but that's it. I've seen other stuff that was better than that. However, I get where he was drafted and I get the whole draft, capital and all that kind of stuff and I get it. But if we offer anything, it needs to be a four. I don't think we should offer a three, not in this draft, because we need too many things.
Speaker 1:Again, I've been talking about guard just now. If will hernandez is not coming back, which is a great idea in everything past russian grade and one block grade, he's better than gvr, so it'll be an upgrade for us to have both of them on the roster. But I haven't heard one peep about the giants looking at will hernandez or brandon schrift. We've been missing it, but I've been keeping up with stuff every day. Throughout the day I haven't heard one peep in that direction. So we'll see what it is. But I got a lot of questions I want us to talk about tonight as we get into talking about that cap space what kind of room they got left, who's on the roster and how it's looking right now with the new additions. So I'm going to get into all that kind of stuff and just have some fun with this.
Speaker 1:But I want to ask you this just is there any way, is there any conceivable way this year that Kane can save his job? Is there anything that he can do to save his job? I feel like the fans have already kind of decided that he's just like a bust. He's done so many bad things and the Saquon thing he can't seem to get away from it. One of the worst scenarios I can think of is if he won the Super Bowl. Never thought it was going to happen. I really didn't at all. When that happened I was like now that hard knocks piece is going to be constantly here like this is part of your legacy. Now. Now, no matter what you do, unless you win a Super Bowl, they're going to say you know what? Remember this I only wanted $2 million more than what you offered him. He wants to stay here and you let him out of the building, and he saved his job by doing anything this year. It's anything he can do. I'm pessimistic. That's why I'm asking you.
Speaker 2:That's a tough one Because I think, first things first, the Giants have to make very clear, tangible improvement on offense. I think if they are going to lose, they better be losing like 31-28 kind of games.
Speaker 1:They did that last year, man no.
Speaker 2:Last year. I mean they lost to the Bengals like what 10-7? They were.
Speaker 1:They lost games by five points or less, almost every game. That's what that was for nerve-wracking to me.
Speaker 2:They got there, they had a fair share of absolute beatdowns Ravens game, atlanta game uh, they, they. Some of the games look closer because they got some garbage time touchdowns that's fair, you know. I believe in scoring, if not dead last.
Speaker 1:It was 31st.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was 31st, so they need to be able to be at the very least middle of the pack, averaging over 20. And I think that has to be the absolute baseline, how many wins they have. And I think that has to be like the absolute baseline how many wins they have. I mean it's kind of hard to say because you know the Giants were arguably the worst team in all of football last year. I know they don't have the first overall pick to show it, but I think there is a very real case that they were the worst team in football. But now we're entering this next season with the hardest schedule I believe it was hardest strength of schedule based on last year in the entire league. You know, I don't even understand how that happens. There's really bad luck with the how that, the non-divisions and the AFC. You know NFC crossover happened there for the scheduling. But if the giants can get to eight wins at least, like I don't think they need to make the playoffs, but I think they need to be competitive. They need to be fighting for at the very least that final wild card spot coming into, going it down the stretch.
Speaker 2:If Shane wants to and this draft class has to hit. He can't, you know, have a 2022, which I think you know. Again, when I say it's underrated, that doesn't mean I think it's good. I just think people call it like as bad as 2021. And now that Aziz Ocalari left for the Eagles, we don't even have a single player from that draft class left on the roster and I'm pretty sure at least half of that draft class isn't even in the league anymore. So he needs to have another 2020, what was this 2024 level draft he has to? The team has to take some major steps forward. I think we're going to need to see that Paul Sanedibo and Javon Holland, in particular, are balling out and, if all the stars align, I think he lives to see 2026. Wow, I think it's I. Just the issue is I don't see it happening. I don't see the stars aligning. I think the schedule is going to be too difficult, I think there's going to be too many hurdles for them to overcome and I just don't see it happening. What?
Speaker 1:about you. What do you think?
Speaker 2:Do you think that's the right area there, that ballpark?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel the same way about that part of it. I've always felt like if we got middle of the road and you were at around 500, that that was better than what we were looking at. And I've talked about this on multiple shows. I went ahead and crunched the numbers. They had nine or ten games. I always share this because I'm just proud of it. It was so close Nine or ten games that we lost by five points or less. If you go back and look at it, you'll see it. I keep getting mixed up between nine or ten games. I think it was like nine or ten games it might have been nine games, five points or less.
Speaker 1:A competent quarterback. We win those games and we're talking about this team being maybe still having the number three, but we're talking about being actually in some kind of hunt at least get a wild card or at least be competitive in that division. That was tough to begin with. So we're probably not winning that anyway, but I might still be in the cellar, but you have nine or ten wins under your belt. And for me I'm like I'm trying to figure out who Joe Shane is. I don't know if I really got a handle on that I know that him and Dave I think they both came from Buffalo, I think, and Dave was you know earlier was considered a quarterback whisperer somehow.
Speaker 2:I don't know how that A lot of credit for Josh Allen's development.
Speaker 1:Okay, I think that's the same time time he was there. Josh was very, very erratic when they were with this. I mean, I don't when, when, dable was there?
Speaker 2:josh? Uh, started bat and then got better every year with dable uh, okay so it yeah. So I'm gonna let you continue before I no, no, that's fine, that's that's.
Speaker 1:that's totally fair, that's good. So I'm trying to figure out who they are and it's because this is the kind of season that we really you might think you already know, but, to be honest, I'm not really sure who they are. I feel like this year is going to tell me that, especially if the schedule is going to be as rough as you're saying it's going to be, we're going to find out what these guys can do in the midst of adversity. There were some areas where Dayball looked kind of rough a couple years and so back since the 2022 season. As far as Joe Shane goes, like you said, those drafts got a hit. I mean, he had a good year, considered because of the guys and how they developed Guys like Tyler Newbin and the guys that had to develop. I mean he did good in that regard, but he had to have a stellar draft this time around. He has to. They got a pick so far. Uh, I don't know whether they're going to get any more. They're going to drop draft backwards or not. Uh, draft down, but they got to do some big things here, because this we talk about going into 14 years of not being competitive. That's for me.
Speaker 1:I've been watching the Giants since I was in diapers. I mean quite literally. And for me I'm like and that was a long time ago, jack, if you know my age, you know how long ago that was. That was a long time ago To see them be on a skid like this. I can go back in the archives and look at all of the games from the 70s. I don't think they've ever been in the skids this long. I could be wrong, but I don't recall that. I periodically go back and look at this kind of stuff. Sometimes they might have a 10 and a 5, a 7 and a 9 season. No, they keep bouncing up and down, but they never be on a 13, 14-year skid.
Speaker 1:This is absolutely unconscionable and I can't explain why this is happening. We can't say because we don't have Eli, we can't do any of that stuff. Those are not valid excuses to have a team that does not compete at all for almost a decade and a half. So everybody that's they're probably going to come on here If we ever go live. They're probably going to come on here. If we ever go live, they're probably going to come on here and we'll have the comments about how we should tank and try to get Arch Manning.
Speaker 1:I can't stomach that idea. You're talking about going 15 years, not being competitive, hoping that that 16 years is going to be the one that hits. That's a gambler's philosophy that hasn't got us anywhere. To try to gamble, that's not going to help us. We need to start winning now and, first of all, playing with heart, not quitting on plays and stuff and having somebody who we want to play for. So if they don't like Dave Ball, I wouldn't know now, but if you like him and you think he's the coach for the future, then play your heart out, play your heart out, play your butt off for them, because the thing that you and I love about Giants football the most, that got us into this. If I'm doing a podcast right now, we haven't seen that in a long time. Do you agree?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:Smash mouth football. We haven't seen that in a long time and we just talked about it on another show, on our T3. We just discussed it. Not having an identity, that's what's killing us. You don't know who you want to be. At least decide if you're going to win by having an outstanding defense and just running over folks, kind of like how we used to then do that. You won Super Bowls by three points against an undefeated juggernaut. How do we do that? We won Super Bowls by three points against an undefeated juggernaut. How do we do that?
Speaker 1:A lot of great things happened on offense. A lot of great things happened on offense. A lot of incredible catches by Manningham and Tyree. I mean, yeah, but the defense, that's what happened. How can you get away from that? Being guys like Strahan and Taylor and Banks, how do you get away from that when you know that's the identity of this city, along with this team? We haven't seen it. Are we getting closer? Right now? You tell me, maybe, maybe, but that's who we are and we just got away from that. What do you think?
Speaker 2:I mean, I 100% agree that we've kind of gotten away from our identity. You know, I remember growing up watching where, even though we had Eli and Plax and Shockey for a while there- you know what got me into it was Tiki, and then the duo of Bradshaw and Jacobs. Yeah, Thunder and Lightning being, you know, running behind that line. With what was it? O'hara Snee? Who else was on that unit?
Speaker 1:O'Hara Snee, they had their on that unit Harris.
Speaker 2:They had their photo in Sports Illustrated. How often does a unit of offensive linemen get their photo in Sports Illustrated? I think never Deal, I think was on that one. He was on that one, and then, a little after that, we ended up getting. What was it? Richburg, he was all right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Weston was one of my favorites.
Speaker 2:But you know we got away from all that. We got away from the units that had Strahan, osi, tuck, pierre, paul, you know, even when we had Vernon and Snacks on that defensive line in 2016, that defense was crazy. Landon Collins, second place for DPOI that year, lost it to Mack. You know we've gotten away from all that but at the same time, like the Giants have felt in the past couple of years and I think 2023, like people act like that was like some heinous year. We were a correctly called game against Buffalo, a healthy kicker against the jets and then a Saquon drop, two point conversion, away from beating the bills, jets and Rams and being the seventh seed in the playoffs Because we would add the tiebreaker over the Rams and the Packers that year In 2023, with Tyrod Taylor and Tommy DeVito.
Speaker 1:You know. So when we talk about like… what does that tell you, though? What does that indicate? What does that tell you, though? What does that indicate, what does that?
Speaker 2:tell you we are a good quarter, we are closer than people think, but we also feel so far away Because I think I'm so conflicted on what I want from this team. I want to be competitive, but I don't want to be stuck in that 7-10, 8-9 purgatory area. So I mean QB purgatory.
Speaker 2:Oh man, it's a real thing man, we've been talking a bit about this. Do you think the Giants should sell the farm and try to trade up to one? Because I think Cam Ward is, in my opinion, the clear best quarterback in this class. I think he would have been QB 5 or 6 last year year. But at the same time, like when people look back at 2023 and everybody talks about oh you know, it cost us caleb, cost us daniels, cost us drake. May you know that three, that meaningless three game win streak, people are acting like we won the last three games of the season, like like when we beat the colts and what was it? The second to last game or whatever this this year?
Speaker 2:I think it was 17, yeah we 17, yes, no this past, when we beat the colts in the second last game. That truly was a meet, in my opinion, a meaningless win. I was happy to see it I love watching the giants win, but deep down I knew that's gonna hurt us. That is going to hurt us, maybe. What was it? Like? The Packers, I think we beat Washington in that little stretch, and who was the third team that we beat?
Speaker 1:The.
Speaker 2:Patriots, the Patriots, we beat the Patriots. Those were like more middle of the season, it wasn't like this team was even eliminated from the playoffs fully when they went on that win streak. And then we were darn close to beating the Rams, we were darn close to beating the Bills, we were darn close to beating the Jets and all of a sudden we would have been like 9-8 and in the playoffs for back-to-back seasons nine and eight and in the playoffs for back-to-back seasons. Um, so I I think a lot of the issue was that for shane and this regime, that 2022 season with a lot of those miracle victories where the defense for so many turnovers, a lot of that I think I think they they got ahead of their skis. I think they thought dable, you know, was truly this magician.
Speaker 2:I think they were kind of in this really terrible situation where, because they didn't pick up dj's fifth year, they had to make a choice between franchising him or saquon, and they knew if they franchised DJ, they would have had no money to make any moves in free agency. So they were like, okay, we're going to kind of do this essentially two-year deal with DJ, we're going to franchise Saquon, see if we can bring him back and that just ticks Saquon off. He wasn't, I don't think. I think after they franchised him, I don't think he wanted to come back and I think after they franchised I don't think he wanted to come back. And now we're in a situation where we have to make that choice. Do we go aggressive and make a move up to one? Do we just sit there and hope Cam Ward falls to us because the two teams ahead of us go Carter-Hunter, hunter-carter? I don't know what do you think? Do you think we make that move in the draft or do we just sit there? Take BPA, take Shador, if he's there?
Speaker 1:That's my next question. That's my next question Do we take a quarterback at three? Do we take Cam Ward if he falls to us? If he falls to us, I'm going to say yes, we should take him. I know that people are saying, oh, we should take him. I know that people are saying, oh, these guys are not world-moving quarterbacks.
Speaker 1:Honestly, man, if I look at free agency just free agency alone, this past free agency look at all the quarterbacks, look at all the quarterbacks that got signed. Not a lot of them were world-beaters at all. It's a long list of quarterbacks. Look it up. Look all the quarterbacks that got signed. Not a lot of them were all were world beaters at all. I mean, it's like a long list of quarterbacks. I mean that's not. That shouldn't be a requirement, because this whole thing of this whole elite conversation I try to stay away from it, especially on social media. I'm like this is, this is not a real conversation. The elite thing it's all subjective. You decide, you almost decide who's elite and who's not, because brady can have a bad year, like he's had a bad year with the bucks throwing wise, and he was still considered elite. How do you do that? So for me, I'm like if cam water sitting there, obviously it's a no-brainer, it's probably the easiest decision that we make. It's the easiest card up to the podium that we can make during the draft Easy. If he's not there, we've got to ask ourselves okay, you know what? What are we going to do? What are we doing now with this whole Russell Wilson, aaron Rodgers thing? We can get into that too.
Speaker 1:I'm not sure how that's going. It looks like we're desperate, we're not being aggressive and that can come back to bite us in this case. In this draft, we need to be aggressive about what we want, but I can't see us going to one because the draft capital we needed so much. There's some ways we need to be trading back. In some cases we need more bodies than what we have right now. Udfa is always an option. You might find a whole bunch of guys that didn't get drafted, that are stars. It happens every year. You almost tell time by it. But I don't want to move up to one. To answer that first part of your question. I don't want to do that. I think we should stand pat at three because we can get some kind of potentially game-changing talent at three If Shador is there.
Speaker 1:I've been back and forth with this the whole offseason, but Mel Kuyper has kind of helped me out a little bit with this with his most recent video. He kind of spoke to me about what tape says, because that's what I care about. I don't care what media says about that, what does the tape say. And if you look at the situation he had in Colorado with the O-line and how he adjusted to that, I think he did a darn fantastic job based on not having an O-line and having essentially one guy to throw to. He threw to Jimmy Horn Jr too, but it was very rare. Travis Hunter was getting all of the looks you know what I'm saying and he was mobile. He was able to escape.
Speaker 1:If he falls to us, we're not in bad shape. We're not going to be destitute. If he falls to us, I think he can help us. How long he helps us, is he a 15-year quarterback with the Giants? I don't know that, but he would definitely help us without question. So I would think about that kind of stuff, the idea about taking somebody else as a non-quarterback. The option is there. We got two guys that could be considered generational talents is the word they use nowadays, I think, with Carter and Hunter.
Speaker 1:I don't know what happens to that quarterback in that scenario, because I don't think Jackson Dahl is going to be sitting there in the second round maybe, but I just I don't right now, the way things are going, what I'm hearing, I don't see it. And it still is coming. I think it still is at 15 or 16, I think it is. I'll double-check that, but I think it's still at 15 or 16, I think it is. I'll double-check that, but I think they're at. Well, no, they're not even there, they're even lower than that.
Speaker 1:Okay, wait a minute. Okay, 21. Okay, if they're at 21 and Jackson Dart hasn't been picked, I think they'll take that man at 21. And we won't have him. So we got to figure out what are you doing that quarterback if, if dart is your guy and you don't want water sanders? So this is a tough question, brother. I doubt I even answered it well, but to me it's ward first, sanders second. If it's possible, if the browns take sanders, but you what? Then you got a choice you either take Carter or Hunter or you drop down, drop down over to the bottom of the first round and grab Dart and then go on from there with your extra picks. I like him that much to take him, but I can't take him at three.
Speaker 2:Yeah, if they take Milrow or Dart at three, I'm going to lose. I I'm gonna lose my damn, my, my darn mind there like it's not gonna happen.
Speaker 1:Don't worry about it.
Speaker 2:Milrow is not going to know three uh, it's not gonna happen that's what people were saying about I my buddy has this video of me when they drafted dj and I lost my mind Because I'm like the past Josh Hines-Allen was right there. I was high on was it? Was that the draft where it was Isaiah Simmons 2019?
Speaker 1:Simmons.
Speaker 2:Was it Roquan Smith? There was a linebacker that I was really high on. Uh, I think I know we we passed on josh hines allen. I, that was my number one guy there that's not.
Speaker 2:That's not all we passed on uh well, we still got dex we still got Dex in that draft, but then we also traded back up for DeAndre Baker and that was a mess. But I think I agree with you Number one choice would be Ward. Number one choice would be Ward. I'd be fine with Shador if he's there. Don't want to trade up for either of these guys. If it goes Ward-Sanders 1-2, I don't know, I do not know who I would want between Carter Hunter or trading back, because I do think a team would give up a lot for either of these two guys and that amount of, I think the amount of draft capital we could get would be invaluable. But so would having a game changer. But with Paulson and Debo now kind of our CB1, I don't know where Travis Hunter would fit unless we've given up on banks. If we've given up on banks and are fine moving banks down to CB4 or 5, depending on how you feel about Flott.
Speaker 1:I'm not really a fan, if you are fine with that.
Speaker 2:As the Giants, again, I am more than okay With them being like it was a mistake. We gotta move on. We gotta improve. We can't be tied to it forever. We gotta just take him because he's the best player Available and then he'll come in for packages On offense. I am more than happy With that strategy With Abdul Carter. Having a rotation of him, kavon and Burns on the outside would be amazing. My biggest issue with Abdul Carter and this is why I don't think I could be a GM he is such a massive Eagles fan. I am genuinely terrified we're going to take this generational prospect out of Penn State University in the top five, who then will put on a few great years for us but ultimately leave us to go to the Eagles, where he will then immediately flourish and win a Super Bowl after somehow not living up to his full potential on the New York Giants. And we look like idiots and we are just repeating the cycle. I could not handle that emotionally.
Speaker 1:You already not handling it right now.
Speaker 2:In case you couldn't tell, I'm still a little salty. Yeah, I can see it. I can see it.
Speaker 1:I was going to actually talk about Aziz, but I changed my mind because you're already about to implode. Oh my God, no, no, no, no. I'm now going to be completely healthy. No, no, no, no. I need you to stay sane, Jess, so we're not going to talk about Ojalávi today. Let's get back.
Speaker 2:But in all seriousness, I truly do think that if they're, I think either take Carter, take Hunter or trade back and see and this is a guy I haven't heard a lot of people talking about the Giants going after, go after, maybe like trade back, depending on how far you go. If he's there, ted McMillan Ted McMillan, the wide receiver out of Arizona. He's 6'4" big body, great hands. You put him on the outside opposite Malik Nabors. I think that could be injured. That could be like a chase and Higgins in Cincinnati. You know you got your all around superstar. You got your big body who could be a one on other teams. I liked him he's got. He's a much better game speed than his combine, you know. Or he didn't have the comment he did at the pro day, but he still hit a sub four or five. I think that could be real interesting.
Speaker 1:This is. This is. This is a strange scenario to be in man, but the one, the one thing about this and I'm hoping this is going to be a good thing I'm going to play another show while I'm on this podcast because I think it's relevant. But on the first round of the draft, you, you know, and I shared it on social media we're gonna be doing on t3 uh, I guess hopefully our first annual live draft special for the entire first round. We're gonna get on about 7 45 pm 750 and stay on for the entire first round.
Speaker 1:People we're going to get on about 7.45 pm 7.50, and stay on for the entire first round. People are going to be in the live chat in studio, the whole thing. I'm sitting here watching this play out and my face is going to be here for everybody to see my reaction. I'm not sure it's a good thing, because in some ways this is kind of stressful Because if Ward and Sanders go one and two which could conceivably happen Denver I just talked about it on the other show Denver brought in no, they got Chubb and they brought in JK Dobbins. So they're going to have to address that quarterback situation at some point in time.
Speaker 2:Cleveland just signed Kevin Jenkins to replace Zeitler.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I saw that and I hated it. I thought we would get a chance to get him. So, yeah, I wasn't thrilled with that one at all. But at quarterback though, kenny Pickett is kind of the only option. Yeah, maybe he can try to fight to be that QB1, but to be real about it, he's battling against himself because Watson's not going to be playing. So they're definitely going to try to do something. That quarterback could they have to.
Speaker 1:When they do it, it's a whole different story. I mean, they can wait for Will Howard, get the hometown boy, so to speak, play at Ohio State. They can do that. They can wait that long and probably grab him and it'll be fine, nobody's going to care. But if they decide to get Sanders, we're sitting here looking at a Hunter or a Standard. It should be easy, bpa, right, all the needs that we have. Any one of these guys would be helpful, but I find that scenario stressful. I don't know why that's stressful to me. I'm like I got to pick between these two guys or hit my third option or trade back. This is stressful. They can go, they can not pick either. One. Pick Mason Graham, like would you do that, though I don't think you would. Would you pick Tet instead of Carter trading back? That only works if you're in the right place, where Tet's going to be at. If you trade back to 10, I don't think Tet's going to be there.
Speaker 1:I think Tet the going to be there?
Speaker 2:No, I don't. I think Tet. The interesting thing would be particularly would be if Ward goes one, sanders goes two. I think we could afford to trade back to six, maybe seven.
Speaker 1:And still get Tet yeah with the Raiders. What do?
Speaker 2:we do draft Hunter at three and then I think, uh, I think Carter would then go four to uh to the Patriots. I think he would be too good to pass up for them don't forget about Jacksonville.
Speaker 1:They're sitting at five. What are they doing?
Speaker 2:they're gonna go, either Mason Graham I think they could go offensive linemen or maybe the Patriots go offensive line. Just be like look, we need to protect May. We just we need to protect him. You know we got to do what the Chargers? Did you just take the best offensive lineman, be that Campbell Banks, uh, which is a face out of Missouri whose name I can't pronounce if I'm not looking. Chargers, did you just take the best offensive lineman? Be that Campbell Banks, which is a face out of Missouri whose name I can't pronounce if I'm not looking at it, and I'm not looking at it right now.
Speaker 1:What are you talking about, Jonah?
Speaker 2:No, no, no, Jonah's out of Arizona, the massive behemoth guy out of Arizona, jonah, what's his name?
Speaker 1:I pronounced it right a few times, but then nah, sabanea, perhaps 64, 324. Sabanea or Sabanea?
Speaker 2:No, that's Arizona. He's a tackle out of Arizona. I'm talking about Armand Membo. I had Membo, right, oh, that's Arizona. He's a tackle out of Arizona. I'm talking about Armand Membo. I had Membo, oh.
Speaker 1:Membo.
Speaker 2:Okay, armand Membo, maybe they go with one of him Campbell or Banks but I think the Giants have been drafting for needs so much that it's gotten in the way. I think they just need to stay pad at three and take BPA. The worst case is the reason. I don't fault the Giants. Everybody gets on them about taking Kayvon and Neal. Those were consensus blue chip guys coming out of 2022. And Kayvon hasn't lived up to the hype, but he hasn't been bad. Neil's been horrific. Neil has been horrific, but I don't fault them for taking him.
Speaker 2:That was the like a few days before the draft. Neil was being as could Jacksonville take him at one Like. And if you're in that discussion and you fall to seven, I don't blame the team that took him. Sure, it sucks and obviously I'm going to give the Giants a little more leeway with something like that than I would another team, but I think that's a fair assessment. Like, look, he was a consensus guy, he just busted, he just didn't work out, you know, and I don't.
Speaker 2:And if that's the case with Hunter or Carter and you take them and they're just not good, I can live with that Like I won't be happy, are you sure I won't be happy, are you sure? I won't be happy about it, certainly. And then obviously you'll look back and be like, oh, why didn't we trade back and take James Pierce, who has been phenomenal on the box, or something like that, whatever. But at the end of the day, we all know what the conversation is going into the draft. And if a team is like I'm just going to and I think the Giants just have to stay pat at three and either take Sanders, take Ward or just take Carter or Hunter, I think at the end of the day they have to do that.
Speaker 1:I got to bring up a couple of things. One of these is something that I would like us to talk about, even if it's the next episode. So jot it down for me. Help me stay accountable on this one, take notes on this one for me.
Speaker 1:I want to talk about that draft that DJ was in, because when you look in the first round and you look at the whole first round all the way down after DJ got picked at six out of Duke, we got to talk about that Because in hindsight, of course, we didn't know what was going to happen. Josh Allen was there right behind at seven Would have been a fine pick Linebackers area we could have definitely used help at. Jonah Williams has been up and down out of Alabama with the Bengals and now he's a free agent and I think I picked up with New England. I think it was. But beside that, names like Christian Wilkins great, great player, but often injured in Miami, if you go down the list.
Speaker 1:Brian Burns is there out of florida state, went to the panthers. Obviously we got him in the trade recently. Desta lawrence we got him at 17. The the list and the options aren't great. I mean, I'm sitting here thinking you know what, maybe we should have got out of the first round period. Don't stand, because you got guys like josh jakey was there, which is you know what I'm saying Because you got guys like Josh Jacobs there, which is definitely a fantastic running back, but obviously you're getting down to DeAndre Baker, who we did pick at 30, nikhil Harry and Marquise Brown.
Speaker 2:I'm like this wasn't a great first round period, Eric.
Speaker 1:Bradbury could have been a nice pickup for us maybe he would have been phenomenal he's had a lot of injuries recently. I mean he's on a new team now as a couple of days ago, but but there was a lot of injuries going on. I mean, this is none. None of this stuff is, uh, a home one, unless you want to say josh jacobs or josh allen. So this was a horrible first round in comparison to other ones. It's not good.
Speaker 2:In terms of guys after Daniel Jones.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I mean, this is not beautiful.
Speaker 2:So this, this, yeah, this draft. There's a lot to talk about there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want us to do that on another episode, maybe the next one, but I brought it up for a reason, because now we're sitting here and you mentioned Ted and I like him, but we have a problem here. If somebody if Ted's somebody that we like I agree with you on the BPA approach. I think we should do that for the entire draft. That's what I think we should do. I think we should go BPA for the entire draft and we had and we just lean on UDFAs and some guys that are hungry who didn't get picked and staff our team, get them down to 53 and go out here and just play ball hard nose smash, mouth, football, like we know how to do and just go for it. However, we got a problem of tests on our mind. Let me show you what I'm talking about. We have three right now. If we decide to trade back, we're going to run into a lot of problems because there's some teams that would. After Carter and Hunter are gone, they're going to have eyes on him immediately. It can happen potentially. It could potentially happen at Jacksonville. It could potentially happen in Las Vegas, with Pete Carroll there now and Geno Smith being the big body to throw to. It could happen with the jets, because they're still trying to do some things offensively and they have to now that justin fields is there.
Speaker 1:Carolina, if you look at their depth chart, you'll see what I mean. Besides tuba hubbard, that's pretty much it. New orleans were 5 and 12 last year and they definitely could use help on offense because derrick hawkey used all the help he could get. He doesn't have Michael Thomas anymore. He ain't got Ken Garb, mike, no more Chicago at 10. Definitely Keenan Allen is gone. That was the safety foul. I guess you could say the wide receiver. Three, the veteran, that's gone. 11, san Francisco they get all the talent out of there. Even rumor that IU is up for a trade. Now I'm like wow. 12, dallas that's not getting past 12. I don't care what's going on, because John T probably can go earlier than 12 unless Dallas decides to move up. So this is about 7-8 teams there. That would take McMillan in a heartbeat. We got to be in the right spot to trade back.
Speaker 2:How far do you think the Giants would even truly consider trading back. I don't know. First of all, the only way I see them trading out of the top ten is if they're getting like a 1-2 this year, a 1-2 next year kind of crazy deal. Because, again, it's not like they're picking at seven right now, they're picking at three. That's going to be a haul that someone would have to. And if you're, first of all, I don't think Ted is worth a top three. I don't even know if he's worth a top five pick. I mean, he's not the quality of prospect that Marvin Harris and Malik Nabors were coming out last year. He's a big body, 6'4 guy. He's great at jump balls.
Speaker 2:Steve Smith just posted his review. He's not super solid on him. He thinks Tet leaves some plays out on the field. But I like what he can do. I like the size. I think he'd be a great guy to pair with Nabors, because that's something we've been missing for a while We've been. I like the size. I think he'd be a great guy to pair with neighbors, you know, just because that's something we've been missing for a while. We've been missing that kind of big body. Go up and get it. Plaxico Burris kind of guy you know on the outside there.
Speaker 1:Oh man, this is not long enough for what I want to talk about.
Speaker 2:Going out at night. But you know all things considered, you know all things considered, you know again. I think at the end of the day, the giants need to sit there and be like warder sanders if they fall, or carter hunter. I think those are the only four guys the giants should truly be considering right now wait, wait.
Speaker 1:Okay, you told my at three right at three.
Speaker 2:If they stay at three, those are the only four guys I think they should let me.
Speaker 1:Let me hit you with some names. I just want you to just think about it and we can kind of uh, after this being kind of a hit, one last topic and we can go ahead and close the show. We got so much that we can talk about. That's why I'm like, oh, we don't have enough show. That's a good problem to have, and now we got more to talk about on the next show. I want I'm gonna say these names to you and just think about this, because this will require the giants to trade back, but think about how awesome this would be.
Speaker 1:Tyler warren from penn state 104 receptions, 1,233 yards, eight touchdowns Think about that. Will Johnson comes in and takes the CB one job, which is a great scenario. I think he's the best cornerback in the draft in my personal opinion. He's from Michigan, so I'm a little bit biased, but anyway, jalon Walker plays linebacker and edge rusher man. Six and a half sacks. I mean just those. I didn't talk about Mike here when I even get into it. I didn't get into that stuff yet. Just think about that. Might even Mike Green for Marshall. My god, there's so much talent sitting at the back of this draft.
Speaker 1:I think if we get down, there, and if we get in those three guys, nobody's giving us, nobody's giving us less than an A grade. If we get in those three guys that I named first, there's no way in the world.
Speaker 2:Here's. Here's my response to that.
Speaker 2:Oh here we go Again. He's one of those guys where I like Theo Johnson I did. I love that pick. I wanted the Giants to take him. He was one of those my guys in the mid-rounds I had last year and we saw flashes of truly what he could do working up the seams big body go up, get it. I liked what I saw from him. Sadly he got injured. Story of being a Giants fan Will Johnson I agree with. I don't know if I truly love him for the scheme or going to potentially be running as more pressed man. His arm length, his arms are a little short to truly be running as more press man. His arm length is the leave it's. His arms are a little short to truly be doing that at the nfl level. Could they be putting him?
Speaker 1:in a man.
Speaker 2:Instead of full-on press, you know, run some more complicated coverages, um, but then guys like uh, I don't remember where he fell jalen walker, guys like Walker, mikael Williams, mike Green, but I do remember this meaning it was a true drop back. It wasn't a screen, it wasn't some quick, it wasn't some halfback or wide receiver screen, it wasn't even play action, just guy drops back into coverage. Abdul Carter, I think, was third in the nation in pass rush win rate.
Speaker 1:Third in the entire country.
Speaker 2:That is crazy and that's why I'm thinking again, unless they get some God-tier package, one, two, three I can't even imagine what that is.
Speaker 1:I can't even imagine what that is and who would do that. I can't even imagine.
Speaker 2:I can't imagine Exactly that's my Unless it's like again the Raiders want to trade us a one and a two this year and then a two next year and a third next year, something like that, where we're not trading that too far, where we're only dropping down a few spots and even then one of those guys might fall to us. You know, because if you know you gotta prioritize protecting Trevor Lawrence, or get him another weapon and then Tom Brady trying to help us win man.
Speaker 1:Tom Brady trying to help us win nothing no, that's my point he's not trying to help us win anything.
Speaker 2:I really want Travis Hunter you want him more than abdul carter hunter, and then more than abdul carter yeah, like, imagine this scenario, like this would be a dream come true for me. Okay, we're sitting there at three. Joe shane's about to make the pick, gets a phone call. It's the raiders. Ra, hey, we'll give you our first this year, our second this year, our second next year and our third next year to move up to three Giants. Accept that kind of deal. I don't know how exactly the pick situation, but just picture really nice draft fall. We're not getting another first, but we're getting a night, a really nice package. They move up. They want Travis Hunter because they've loved, you know they've been all in on color Colorado. They're another team that's been sending scouts to like all their games and practices. Carter goes.
Speaker 2:Three Patriots are sitting there at four. They go offensive line. We got are sitting there at four. They go offensive line. We got to protect Drake. May Jacksonville is sitting there at five. They know Pass rusher isn't necessarily a need for them. They go hey, we're going to take Mason Graham, we'll take Tet. We'll take Tett, we'll take, depending on who the Patriots select. What's the offensive line in this scenario? I'm sorry, the oh, my God, the Jags, oh my.
Speaker 2:God, I'm forgetting. I'm thinking Jacksonville, but I can't remember what their mascot was. The Jags are like you know what, we'll take Membo because you guys put Campbell and Carter just somehow falls to six Again. But that's a crazy scenario, that's so unlikely. I had to justify in this, like why wouldn't the Patriots just take Carter there at four?
Speaker 1:So that's why I think you know, mike Vrabel is not letting that man get past him. That's the only part about that I'm like. Vrabel is not. I don't think Belichick would have did it either.
Speaker 2:It would take some crazy dream scenario for that kind of thing to happen.
Speaker 1:Or just take him at three.
Speaker 2:I don't see it happening.
Speaker 1:Just take him at three. I don't see it happening. Just take him at three and then we don't need for the scenario.
Speaker 2:Exactly that's what I'm saying. Like if the if the giants are sitting there at three and I Carter, you know, and Ward Sanders goes one, two, sit there, take either Hunter or Carter. If it goes Carter, Hunter, sit there, take Ward. That I take either Hunter or Carter. If it goes Carter or Hunter, sit there, take Ward. That's just what I think, All right.
Speaker 1:Now I am assuming you're going to be on this live draft special with me, correct?
Speaker 2:I have no idea. I haven't discussed it with him yet.
Speaker 1:I need you to take some time and breathe, think about it, think about my question again and give me a different answer, because I need you in the box for more, if nothing else, for moral support In case something goes crazy, because I don't know what to expect with this draft. This is going to be. Somebody's going to try to get up there to the top, or at least up in the first five. I don't know who it is, but somebody's going to try this.
Speaker 2:It might be the Raiders. Somebody's going to try it For some reason. I don't think anybody's talking about it.
Speaker 1:They don't have enough draft capital for this man. They need picks and they don't have any money.
Speaker 2:They don't have any. That's a gamble. That's gone, destroyed by void year push-offs. Oh my God, I'm just praying. The same thing happens to Philly man. I am, I'll just void year.
Speaker 1:Let those cap hits, hit baby, please time for the top of the empire to go down right.
Speaker 2:I feel you, man around one year too long this I know that's right.
Speaker 1:I know that's right, brother. You did it, man. The first episode was in the books. Man, how does it feel?
Speaker 2:feels good man, again I've been. I you can tell I can keep going. We can make this a three-hour pod if we wanted to I know, I know, I know I can.
Speaker 1:I got enough information for a four-hour pod in here, but I'm we're not. We're not doing that. This is good. It's good for us to have an hour. We can just kick it and go through all this stuff. It's fun, man. It's really fun, man. But I appreciate you so much, brother. This was fantastic, to say the least. This is better than what I expected, man. So I'm excited, hope everybody kind of vibes with this and enjoy what's coming out. But we're going to go ahead and shut this down, man, but we bleed blue baby. We're excited about this draft and we don't know how are we going to sleep tonight Talking about all these scenarios. It's blue baby all day long, every day, all day. You know what I mean. This is good, man, but I'm with you. That's Jess. We out man. Big Blue Lifers man, all you guys that are down with Big Blue, hit us up, come join the squad, join the chat. Love to hear your thoughts on our New York football giants. We're out of here, man. Have a good one.
